Tamra’s Therapy, Jenn’s Finances, and Katie’s TikTok Drama

We Wine Whenever (00:00.738)
Hi, welcome to We Wine Whenever. I'm Wendy. We're talking about Real Housewives of Orange County, Season 18, Reunion Part 2. And we start off kind of where we ended with Shannon saying to Emily, if Jen is saying the only part Ryan had was his name on the account, and Emily jumps in and says, that is the opposite of everything I read. Now, one of the things I noted this whole reunion, now part one and part two,

Kelli (00:03.074)
I'm Kelly.

We Wine Whenever (00:31.199)
Emily is so aggressive. I mean, just so aggressive. She's like, with her words, she's aggressive and physically she's aggressive, like pointing and flailing her arms around. It's just, it's...

Kelli (00:34.543)
I agree.

Kelli (00:44.132)
Yeah.

It's not like her. I don't know what it is. It's not, I don't think we've, I mean, I think we've seen a side of Emily where she's outspoken and she says what she thinks, but this is just a different, different kind of Emily.

We Wine Whenever (01:03.838)
I agree. mean, after that, says, Emily says at the end of the day, I would respect you and Ryan more if you just said, you know, I made some, if he said, I know you made some bad choices and Jen says, I don't owe you that. She doesn't. She doesn't.

Kelli (01:15.264)
No, she doesn't. You know, and as I was sitting there, I'm thinking, do understand that the women, most of them are genuinely worried about her. I don't think Tamara's worried about her at all. I don't think Heather is either. I think Gina is. I think Emily is. But Emily, think Emily is more concerned with being right and figuring it out. Not necessarily proving that Ryan's guilty, but just

We Wine Whenever (01:27.244)
I don't think Heather is either, to be quite honest with you.

yeah, Gina.

Kelli (01:45.038)
Figuring it out. and I think Shannon is worried about her. So I get it. Like, you know, they just want to make sure she's protected, but there's no reason for the aggression and there's no reason for, I mean, we'll get it, you know, cause it happens later on, but. Camera is fucking messy, especially with that FBI hat, like uncalled for, uncalled for. I don't understand though.

We Wine Whenever (01:56.075)
Yeah, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (02:02.858)
Yes, it does happen later on.

Kelli (02:16.77)
why his name was on an account.

We Wine Whenever (02:20.0)
Well, I mean, he was helping his friend. He was involved! He was involved!

Kelli (02:23.992)
So he definitely, he was definitely involved. He definitely knew something and he took a plea deal. So is that like, is that what Emily's trying to get out of him? Not, I totally agree with you, but right. So why do you keep poking at it? Like we know, we know that this is what happened and he doesn't owe you an explanation or anybody for that matter. Certainly not after the way Tam retreated him all season.

We Wine Whenever (02:28.991)
You don't, yeah. Yes, you don't get full immunity.

But she doesn't need to get out of him. It's already been established that that's what happened. And, right, right.

Right.

We Wine Whenever (02:49.162)
Right. Exactly.

No, no.

Kelli (02:54.734)
Why would he want to say anything to any one of you? Okay.

We Wine Whenever (02:59.754)
Yeah, no, he definitely took a plea and he doesn't know anybody anything. And then Emily says after that, you know, while pointing to Katie, Katie, you said your husband at that engagement party stood in the corner because he didn't want to be around those guys. And she's like, yeah, he did say that. Right. Yeah.

Kelli (03:14.884)
She didn't have to say it. It was right on camera. I didn't catch it the first time you told me. But then when they replayed it at the reunion, it was right on camera.

We Wine Whenever (03:23.658)
Right. then Heather says, Heather says, Jen, at the end of the day, we're just concerned about you and we're worried that you're going to, you know, you're going to wind up in a spot and you don't want to be at. And Heather says, yeah, we can't, we can't say what we're all collectively thinking because we care about you. And Shannon says, I'm not thinking anything. And then she's like, well, no, not, I'm not going to speak for everyone, but you just were Heather. You were just trying to speak for everyone.

Kelli (03:45.594)
Right.

Kelli (03:52.75)
Yes, she was.

We Wine Whenever (03:53.949)
And then Andy brings up that Tamar received the cease and desist letter and Tamar's talking in circles saying like, yes, but that's because I was at this event earlier in the day. know, again, she doesn't.

Kelli (04:07.884)
And then, and she basically says that she doesn't remember saying what she said. And Eddie was like, no, you did. You said it.

We Wine Whenever (04:12.433)
Right. Right.

Right. I know. Why don't you remember that? Were you drunk then too? Because you don't remember what happened after Katie's house either, that your husband slept in the casita. You don't remember that either. So who has the drinking problem? Right?

Kelli (04:20.642)
Right. Were you drunk?

Kelli (04:27.01)
Right. Right. Right.

And it's just so funny that she actually said it to Gina on camera and then denied it at the reunion. And then they rolled the tape. Like, come on, you've been doing this long enough. You know they have, you know they have, they're gonna run the tape.

We Wine Whenever (04:45.94)
Yeah.

Kelli (04:49.826)
Something happened on, it doesn't matter, but something happened on your TV behind you. The picture's gone.

We Wine Whenever (04:49.93)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (04:54.56)
yes.

Kelli (04:59.372)
It doesn't matter. I just wanted to bring it to your attention.

We Wine Whenever (05:01.131)
No, thank you. I would like to put it back up because it looks ugly behind me. I don't like that.

We Wine Whenever (05:13.973)
There we go. Thank you. Okay, so then Andy asked Katie what her reaction was to the way Tamar acted at the dinner party. And Katie says, well, you know, she was emotional and Tamar, and then Tamar says, well, I was plastered. I didn't even remember the next day. Okay, well then what does that tell you? Like.

Kelli (05:14.35)
There you

Kelli (05:36.095)
Stop calling Shannon a drunk. Stop it. And how about when Jen called her out for cheating on Simon? That was amazing. Good for her. Like you deserve grace and forgiveness, but Ryan doesn't.

We Wine Whenever (05:38.406)
Right. that's when...

We Wine Whenever (05:42.96)
yeah, I love that. absolutely... Yep. Yep.

We Wine Whenever (05:51.218)
Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. And then Andy asks Jen like why she wasn't interested in seeing that Shannon is the one who initiated the background check on Ryan. I love Jen's response. She's like, listen, Shannon takes accountability and she's apologized and I believe her apology. Like she's working on herself and she's a different person.

Kelli (05:52.569)
What is that?

Kelli (06:12.59)
Which is exactly what Gina said when Aslan posed the same question.

We Wine Whenever (06:14.578)
Right. Exactly. Exactly. And then she's like, I can see that, know, Shannon's trying to do better. And Emily said, well, that's because I yelled at her outside the restaurant in London. Like, and I don't blame Shannon. Like, don't, you don't know what I would have done. Like, you don't know that. That's what I'm saying. Emily just was so, and you could even see it on Gina's face. Like Gina's reaction was like,

Kelli (06:18.618)
Mm-hmm.

Kelli (06:34.072)
Right. Right.

Kelli (06:43.214)
Yes, it's the closer she gets to Tamra. Tamra's gonna bring her down. She needs to separate herself from Tamra. She really, really does.

We Wine Whenever (06:51.443)
She really does.

And then Jen says to Tamar, like, when does it stop with you? Everyone would rather be by your side than against you. And Heather said, I don't feel that way. I know. I know. I know.

Kelli (07:03.244)
bullshit. I call bullshit on that. She's she is so scared of Tamra. I call bullshit on that.

We Wine Whenever (07:11.156)
So then Jen says to Heather, asked you if you were really friends with her and you paused and you said, we're historical friends. And Heather's like, no, no, no, no, no. She's like, that's what you said. And I could see her saying that, historical friends, because that's not a word like everyone would use. Like that's something that fancy pants would use.

Kelli (07:25.452)
It was absolutely.

It was very, I thought it was very obvious that Heather was lying in that moment and that Jem was telling the truth. I thought it was very obvious.

We Wine Whenever (07:36.842)
Yeah, yeah, I did too. I did too. And then Andy said, well, you're starting to Tamra, like, well, you're starting therapy tomorrow. And then all of a sudden, like Heather said to her, I'm so proud of you. Everyone's allowed to evolve. And Emily said, well, I'm glad to see you evolving at 55. Are you 55? She's like, I'll take it. Like, come on, like give me a break. It's a little bit too little too late.

Kelli (08:04.174)
Yep. I agree. I mean, listen, you can go to therapy and you can evolve all you want, but I think the damage is done on the show. I don't think people want to see your back.

We Wine Whenever (08:15.38)
I don't either and I really feel like during this reunion, Andy was really trying to help Tamara. he's, he was the one who, yeah, he was the one who put out like, well you're going to therapy tomorrow or you know, like he's always, like I didn't see him doing that with anybody else.

Kelli (08:22.304)
I think he always does, just like with Teresa.

Kelli (08:33.068)
No, that's what he does. He does that for her. He does it for Teresa. It's bullshit. It's complete bullshit.

We Wine Whenever (08:42.577)
It is, it absolutely is. So then Andy asked, what was Travis's reaction to you talking about his balls to Gina? And Gina's like, yeah, it's his favorite thing. He's having a great year.

Kelli (08:54.916)
She's like, it's his favorite thing.

Kelli (09:01.859)
Yeah, yeah.

We Wine Whenever (09:04.873)
So then they bring up about Jen being evicted and, actually, Andy starts it this way. Jen was being evicted and all of her friends were becoming amateur accountants and flashed to Gina calling out Heather on saying she was concerned. Heather's saying she's concerned, but yet she's the one who's going to look at price tags and being a mean girl. Yeah, no.

Kelli (09:30.926)
was worried for you. No you weren't. You went and looked at the dress, you looked at the price tag, and then you called Tamra and was like, she's buying a $2,000 dress. Like, F you, Heather. That was mean girl behavior. Katie was absolutely 100 % right.

We Wine Whenever (09:39.76)
Right. Right, exactly, exactly.

We Wine Whenever (09:47.772)
Yeah, she absolutely was. then Andy asked Emily if her anger is, because she was very angry about the money too, if it was about her growing up. And she said, you know, my mother and maybe it's the attorney in me, which I do think that that's true, but it's still not an excuse. It's still not an excuse.

Kelli (10:05.78)
No, and I think that, you know, Emily was obviously very established before she and Shane got married. Like she was a practicing attorney. and she prob, and you know, did it all on her own, obviously. nothing was handed to her.

We Wine Whenever (10:20.752)
Well, did she? I mean, did she do it all on her own?

Kelli (10:24.91)
Well, mean, according to her upbringing, I don't think her mother was sitting and studying with her and helping her pay for college. Yeah, she was an attorney before she and Shane got married. yeah. She had her career before they got married. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And I'm sure she looked at, you know, after after that and knowing how her mom, I guess, made excuses.

We Wine Whenever (10:30.016)
No, but she was an attorney before she got married?

We Wine Whenever (10:38.363)
Okay.

Okay, so then she did do that on her own.

We Wine Whenever (10:51.429)
Right.

Kelli (10:51.906)
Now she looks at Jen like that, which, you know, it's the same thing as Mary Cosby looking at Brittany on Salt Lake. Like, you know, you can take care of your kids. You're choosing not to for men. It's not that you're poor. It's not that you don't have the means. You're just making a choice.

We Wine Whenever (10:58.651)
Yes.

We Wine Whenever (11:04.505)
Right, because of... Right.

We Wine Whenever (11:12.678)
Right. No, I agree with that. And then Emily is again talking about, know, she doesn't understand the contract part of it. The lawyer in her doesn't understand how you can sign a contract when you can't afford it. you know, Jen pretty much explained that many times, but she explained it again, pretty simply. They were both nesting in that house. The bills had, he's an attorney. Exactly. He is an attorney. So.

Kelli (11:14.639)
Now.

Kelli (11:34.158)
Right, and he's an attorney.

Kelli (11:40.09)
So if somebody's gonna read the contract out of that relationship, it's going to be the attorney.

We Wine Whenever (11:44.943)
Yes. And he had been paying it all this time. She did not know that this other stuff was going on.

Kelli (11:51.746)
Right, right. It was interesting what Emily said though about him being an attorney and how they look down on that. You know, him not consistently paying, like it could affect his, you know, yeah, that was interesting. I mean, as it should be for sure, but.

We Wine Whenever (12:00.199)
Of they do!

We Wine Whenever (12:06.161)
Career. Yeah, absolutely.

Yes. Yeah, because it's a legal issue and you're not abiding by it. So yeah, you definitely could get disbarred for that.

Kelli (12:15.898)
Yeah.

Kelli (12:19.554)
Yeah, I mean, I know people who don't follow their agreement.

We Wine Whenever (12:24.764)
Yeah. Are they attorneys? Yeah. it's higher stakes when you're an attorney. But then even still, when she's saying about, you know, now I know my bills. I wasn't in that spot now. I'm paying my car payment. Lisa, but I thought you got your car from Ryan. Okay. And? And then she's like, well, does he have a payment? Yes, he does. But why is this your business?

Kelli (12:27.234)
No. Right.

Sure.

Kelli (12:42.916)
Great.

Kelli (12:48.152)
Yeah, there were way too many questions to Jen. I totally agree with you about, you know, about the car, about the dress, about the money. Like, leave her alone.

We Wine Whenever (12:54.235)
Her finances, yeah. Yep. Right, it was too interrogative, right? She's not on trial here, this is a reunion.

Kelli (13:02.36)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. And she's on the show. Like I think because Gina is, was always so forthcoming with her divorce and her financial situation, because obviously I guess out of the whole group, those two would be the least, those two would be the two with the least amount of money. Gina's always been very forthcoming about it.

We Wine Whenever (13:27.888)
Yeah, probably, yeah. Right.

Kelli (13:31.93)
And I, but I also think that Jen's forthcoming about it, but it doesn't mean that they don't deserve to be there along with Heather. Just because she's got, you know, unlimited funds. They were cast on the show.

We Wine Whenever (13:45.446)
I'll be honest with you.

I like Gina a lot. I like Jen a lot. I didn't like Jen at first, but now I like Jen.

Kelli (13:50.243)
Me too.

Kelli (13:55.62)
Well, I think the thing is, that Tamara has made these people more like.

We Wine Whenever (14:00.091)
That is very true. That is very true. But there's a lot of Bravo fans that don't think Gina has a rightful spot on this cast because she's not as well off and that she lives in her condo or whatever they call it. Like they don't think that she deserves to be there. I think she deserves to be there. I mean, that's ridiculous to say. I mean, it's not like it's Beverly Hills, it's the OC.

Kelli (14:23.596)
I, exactly, exactly. It's not Beverly Hills. Yeah, I have been enjoying Gina this season. I think she's brought a lot to the show this season, especially the way she's advocating for Shannon and now Jen.

We Wine Whenever (14:29.446)
You know.

We Wine Whenever (14:42.118)
Yes, exactly, exactly. And she came in hot for Jen in the beginning of the season.

Kelli (14:44.451)
Yeah.

Kelli (14:47.914)
Yeah, like I just think that I don't think OC is known for their opulent lifestyles, just like Jersey's not. Jersey's not either.

We Wine Whenever (14:56.398)
Right. No, you're right. You're right.

Kelli (14:59.694)
So I'm good with it. They put Monica Garcia on Salt Lake.

We Wine Whenever (15:03.034)
Yeah. So then it comes out, you know, that Ryan paid for the dress. Again, I don't think we should be talking about all this stuff. And Heather's maintaining what she was doing was not gossipy or mean. It was gossipy, not mean girl. She said it was gossipy, not mean. What is the difference? Seriously.

Kelli (15:10.33)
Yeah, who cares?

Kelli (15:16.963)
Bye.

Kelli (15:20.63)
Exactly. You're still making fun of somebody basically and calling them out for not having what you have. And that is mean girl behavior. That's not gossipy. That's mean girl behavior.

We Wine Whenever (15:28.344)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (15:34.19)
It absolutely is. the other thing that Andy did, because after this whole thing, he's the one who brought up about how she was supposed to get the lump sum of $200,000 and $6,000 a month. really honestly, I don't think that should be reunion talk. is that? Why are we talking about their finances? That really should not be a part of this. Especially, one, it's not settled. Two, there's children involved.

Kelli (15:48.205)
No, I don't either.

We Wine Whenever (16:02.406)
I don't know why this is a part of the story. I don't think it should be brought up on the reunion. I really don't. I think it was low on Andy's part. I think Jen was very forthcoming in everything that she answered. mean, Emily even admitted that she never has never bad mouth her ex. Right. Right. And that she needs to be a little bit less respectful. And that's not who she is. You can see that's not who she is. I just.

Kelli (16:12.772)
She was. She was.

Kelli (16:18.606)
Right, they all said that she's been very respectful.

Kelli (16:28.396)
No, and I mean that would only hurt her children, so why would you do that?

We Wine Whenever (16:32.581)
Right. She doesn't want him... Right. She doesn't want to get... see him get disbared. I mean, he doesn't have the money now. How is it going to happen if he doesn't have his license?

Kelli (16:33.793)
is making the right choice.

Not whole lot.

Exactly. Absolutely.

We Wine Whenever (16:43.779)
I don't know, really, when Andy started asking those questions, it just once again made me look at Andy like, why are you making this so toxic? It doesn't have to be this way. Like we don't need to know that. Yeah, we know it, it's in the tabloids, but why does it need to come up on the reunion? Who, she doesn't need to answer this to you guys. I don't know, it turned my stomach the whole thing. It really did.

Kelli (16:53.496)
Yep. Right.

Kelli (17:00.952)
Right, right.

Kelli (17:07.448)
Yeah, I agree.

We Wine Whenever (17:10.882)
And even the whole Travis thing that he brought up when he asked her about Travis and how things are going and you know she really can't talk about that either.

Kelli (17:18.788)
Well, I was gonna ask you, did you listen to the latest Bravo docket where they're talking about Gina and Travis? Where they're reading pleadings between he and his ex-wife. It's good, listen to it. It's not that long, I don't think. There are some interesting things in there about Travis. Like there was somebody else in between his ex-wife and Gina who he moved in with very quickly.

We Wine Whenever (17:28.479)
No, I did not. Okay.

We Wine Whenever (17:37.261)
Okay.

Kelli (17:43.62)
just like he did with Gina. It does seem like he wants to share expenses with people very quickly. It was very interesting, but I personally don't think, I think that Gina should have told Andy prior to, or the producers or whatever, prior to the reunion. I can't talk about it because when you listen to that, what's going on between them, like she said, I don't think I'll ever be done with this. They will never be done with this.

We Wine Whenever (18:12.942)
Really?

Kelli (18:13.272)
You like to think that when your kids are adults, the toxicity could stop. But if you have these tendencies to behave this way in conflict with your ex, that's never going away. And it's bad between them, like the mudslinging between them. It is a shame because only their children are going to suffer.

We Wine Whenever (18:32.78)
That's a shame.

Kelli (18:39.194)
But I totally understood why Gina did what she did after listening to that because basically the woman was putting in pleadings, alleged stories that her kids were coming home telling her about Gina and Travis. So Gina was basically like, if they don't live with me, she can't make up stories about me and then say, my kids told me. So it does make sense.

We Wine Whenever (19:02.466)
Right.

Yeah, again, it shouldn't have been, it shouldn't be brought up. It's not our business. It's not our business. And there's other people and there's other children involved.

Kelli (19:09.878)
No, that definitely should not have been brought up.

Nope. And honestly.

And it's only going to hurt Gina and Travis more because once this woman sees that they're talking about her on an OC reunion, that's going to be another pleading with the court. And this woman's family is extremely wealthy and Travis was representing himself.

We Wine Whenever (19:28.353)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (19:36.489)
He's an attorney? No. Yeah, well, well, that's kind of dumb. You, you think, I know, but you would think that, listen, her friend Emily is an attorney. You think maybe she could give him some advice or, you know?

Kelli (19:39.179)
Pro se anybody can represent themselves pro se yeah Yeah, but you know legal fee

Kelli (19:56.438)
I'm hoping she does, I'm sure she does. But this is, it's ugly. What they're doing to each other is very ugly.

We Wine Whenever (20:06.967)
That's a shame. That's a shame. So then after that, they go on a lunch break and we see Heather goes in to talk to Shannon and says,

Kelli (20:08.024)
Yeah. Yeah.

Kelli (20:16.12)
Did Heather say, don't eat solids? Did you hear her say that?

We Wine Whenever (20:19.57)
yeah. Yes, I do think that they, did, yes, I did hear that. I don't know what that was about, but she goes in to talk to Shannon and she said, I think you handled yourself perfectly. And Heather asks if they're good and Shannon's like, yeah, yeah, we're good. And then she goes off. Then before that, Katie asks Jen if she can talk to her. And then they go back in their, you know, their trailer and Katie says to Jen, like, I hope I didn't.

Kelli (20:25.494)
Okay.

We Wine Whenever (20:49.613)
put you on the spot when I said that about what Heather said about checking the price tag. And Jen's like, no, what you said was right. She's like, well, I know that you're in a better place with her. And she's like, no, no, what you said was right. And it was right, you know? And then Tamar goes off into Alexis's trailer, of course. And yeah, they both have the exact same hairstyle. I wonder if they had the same stylist, probably. They probably shared the same hair stylist.

Kelli (21:02.286)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Kelli (21:09.272)
Yeah, that was annoying.

We Wine Whenever (21:19.65)
Cause she got there later.

We Wine Whenever (21:25.846)
Tam is trying to give her advice not to be John's mouthpiece. And, you know, she's no, no, it didn't. No.

Kelli (21:31.886)
That didn't work.

We Wine Whenever (21:37.506)
But you know, whatever. I like that by the time she got out on the stage, there was only eight minutes left of actual air time. So I mean, yeah, no. I mean, hopefully she's gone shortly after it picks up next time.

Kelli (21:44.952)
Yes. Yes. Hopefully she's gone when it picks up next time, but I have feeling she's not.

Kelli (21:55.098)
That was great when Andy was trying to tell Shannon like, don't repeat what you said, don't. And she was like, I won. I'll say whatever I want, I won.

We Wine Whenever (21:58.965)
I know.

We Wine Whenever (22:05.856)
Yeah, it's true. It's true. So after they get back from lunch, Andy asks Emily what she thought about the comment that Heather made about the dress being too tight in her confessional. And Emily said, actually, I thought that was out of character for Heather. But it just proved my point that, you know, people are always commenting about my size and my weight. And then Heather said, yeah, I did take a shot at you. It's the first time she's ever really owned it, but she didn't even own it.

Kelli (22:07.194)
Mm-hmm.

Kelli (22:32.42)
For sure.

We Wine Whenever (22:33.568)
She didn't really own it because she's like, took so many shots at me this season. I wish that they would run a montage of it. I wouldn't enjoy watching it, but I'm sure you would. And Emma's like, yeah, I would enjoy watching it.

Kelli (22:44.282)
But there were only three things and quite honestly she wasn't taking shots at her. Like I forget, I wrote down three things but I didn't write down what they were. They weren't bad, they weren't terrible.

We Wine Whenever (22:50.134)
No.

We Wine Whenever (22:55.777)
No, they really weren't. I didn't write them down either.

Kelli (22:59.182)
They weren't as bad as saying somebody who is self-conscious about their weight and how they look was wearing a dress that was too tight on them. Nothing Emily said even compared to that. And know, Katie was right when she said to Jen, Heather gets defensive when she's not painted perfectly. And then she calls them boring.

We Wine Whenever (23:08.094)
Exactly.

No, I agree. I agree.

We Wine Whenever (23:21.47)
It's true.

Yep. Yes, that's exactly what happened. That's exactly what happened. So then Andy brings up the whole thing about what Katie's daughter said on the TikTok.

Kelli (23:29.255)
No.

Kelli (23:38.048)
on TikTok. You know, this girl's clearly here for the fame, but she should not be talking about these women. She should not be talking about these women.

We Wine Whenever (23:44.449)
No, no, she shouldn't. absolutely shouldn't. know, Katie said that, you know, she apologized. She did mean to imply that, you know, Emily was a bad mother. And Tamara said she thought it was funny how you

they both thought it was funny what the kids said. They thought it was Emily's kids that said it, because that's what her daughter said. They both thought it was funny because they were young and out of the mouse. They didn't think it was going to be a big deal, her and Tamara. But obviously, they didn't think it through, or they did think it through, and that's what their angle was. Yeah.

Kelli (24:18.617)
Right, right.

Kelli (24:26.542)
I think it's the latter. Did you hear that Emily's nanny came out, ex-nanny came out and said that absolutely 100 % Emily talks about Heather and doesn't like her and those kids probably did say it?

We Wine Whenever (24:32.841)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (24:39.136)
I did see that. I did see that, but you know, who knows? Who knows if that's true?

Kelli (24:45.814)
I know, everybody's gonna look for a payday at this point, you know?

We Wine Whenever (24:49.586)
Right. I mean, we saw Katie's son on camera. So.

Kelli (24:53.294)
Yeah, Katie's definitely talking about Heather to her children. So.

We Wine Whenever (24:56.628)
Yeah, yeah. But Katie did explain it too. was, you know, he saw her crying when she got home from the golf outing. It was right after the golf outing. And Heather's like, well, what does that have to do with me? Well, she was crying because of her interaction with you. That's what it has to do with you. Like.

Kelli (25:11.33)
Right, right. And honestly, I don't see Shane allowing that in his house. I think Shane runs a very tight ship and I think Emily follows his lead and falls in line when she asked to. I know she's outspoken. I know nobody's pushing her around, but I think that that's probably one of the reasons she's so attracted to Shane is because he does have that demeanor and he has control over his home, which a lot of people don't.

We Wine Whenever (25:20.725)
I do too.

We Wine Whenever (25:35.274)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (25:38.954)
Yeah, I believe that that's correct. No, I believe that that's correct also. But to even hear Heather say the words of what Katie's daughter said.

Kelli (25:50.722)
I know.

We Wine Whenever (25:50.858)
I like, I don't know. Yeah.

Kelli (25:53.474)
And everybody's like, clutching their pearls. Like, come on.

Like stop putting her up on a pedestal and she'll stop acting like she's the queen over everyone.

We Wine Whenever (26:04.2)
Yeah. I mean, honestly, in this situation, I do feel bad for Katie because listen, her daughter's 20 years old and she's going to do what she's going to do. Our kids do stupid shit. Right. Our kids do stupid shit all the time.

Kelli (26:12.154)
She can't control what she puts, exactly. She can't control what she puts on her social media.

We Wine Whenever (26:18.204)
Right. And the fact that Heather said, my children are 20 and they would never do that. Well, that's because that's who your children are. Yeah. And Shannon, even Shannon said, well, my, well, that's who your kids are. Listen, I know about bad kids. do. mean, kids that make bad choices. Let's put it that way. They're not bad kids, but I know of kids that make bad choices and they're kids. And even if they're 20.

Kelli (26:23.748)
Good for you, Heather. Good for you.

Kelli (26:29.143)
Right.

Yep. Exactly. Exactly.

Yep. Exactly. And it doesn't make their parents any less of a parent than somebody whose child wouldn't make that decision.

We Wine Whenever (26:46.567)
Right, exactly. And then pretty much, know, Katie puts on that she, you know, she didn't approve of it. And then the next thing we see is that Alexis walks in and Andy says, congratulations on your engagement.

Kelli (27:04.686)
How about when Gina and Emily were like, they're letting the lunatic out of their cage. That was good.

We Wine Whenever (27:08.895)
I know.

We Wine Whenever (27:13.664)
What happened next? So Andy says, when you were first on the show, you were very religious. She said, well, I still am. I don't like to say religion. I think of it more as spirituality. You know, I believe God first, husband, and then children. Okay. And then Andy, this is another thing that I thought was a little bit odd, this question. Again, Andy asks,

Kelli (27:31.404)
Yeah, she's right. She's right. She's not wrong there.

We Wine Whenever (27:43.121)
Alexis, has your children's sexuality changed your views?

Kelli (27:49.498)
Right, like are you no longer a Christian because you have a child that identifies as a different sex than... That was shady AF.

We Wine Whenever (27:52.082)
right.

We Wine Whenever (27:57.139)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (28:00.701)
Right, why do you, why? Like why? I just didn't, I didn't think it was appropriate either.

Kelli (28:03.439)
Right.

Right. Not at all. Did his parents change their views on Judaism when he came out as a gay man? Somebody should have asked him that. Because it's insulting.

We Wine Whenever (28:14.665)
Right.

It is insulting. It really is insulting.

Kelli (28:20.89)
It's 100 % insulting.

but not surprising that he asked that question.

We Wine Whenever (28:26.888)
Yeah.

Yeah. Andy said, where does it stand with you and John?

Shannon said, are, about the lawsuit. Where does it stand with you and John at the lawsuit? And I thought when she was saying I won that in the preview, I thought she was done with the John thing.

Kelli (28:50.776)
I think that's what they wanted everybody to believe.

We Wine Whenever (28:53.059)
Yeah, so she said she's still waiting on his, you know, answer.

Kelli (28:58.138)
from signing the disparagement agreement, or agreeing to.

We Wine Whenever (29:00.146)
But so what I'm thinking is, it really, is it a lawsuit? were the papers ever actually filed? Or?

Kelli (29:09.59)
I don't, probably not if they're talking settlement. I mean, maybe a complaint was filed, it, well, yeah, no, I think he did file a complaint because when asked, yes, when asked about the timing because it was so coincidental that now Alexis is back on the show and they're filming and now this happens, he said that the statute was going to run out because the two years was approaching.

We Wine Whenever (29:22.6)
She set a statute. The statute was going to run out,

Kelli (29:38.158)
So he must have filed something.

We Wine Whenever (29:40.894)
So I wonder why her attorney didn't go fight it and ask for legal fees.

Kelli (29:53.838)
Well, he probably filed an answer. And in the answer, you can request legal fees. But I think that they're just trying to settle it. think that they're to obviously keep the attorney's fees lower. If you settle it, you know.

We Wine Whenever (29:56.22)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (30:10.024)
I did think it was interesting about what she said about the whole Jim Bolino lawsuit that she was actually at the Quiet Woman with John and she was about to sign a settlement. And then he just provoked the whole situation. she, she, again, she went and she fought it and she won, but she still had to pay the legal fees. Again, she should have gone after him for those legal fees.

Kelli (30:22.627)
Yes.

Kelli (30:27.47)
Yes.

Kelli (30:33.049)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (30:35.282)
And I hope it's not the same attorney. I hope it's not the same attorney. mean, maybe, I don't know.

Kelli (30:35.448)
Yeah, I don't know why she didn't.

Kelli (30:40.62)
And I'm wondering, did Tamra not win her lawsuit with Jim because she had to pay 500,000? It sounds like she, Tamra was found guilty in that.

Because why would her attorney fees be so much more? Like did she have to pay her attorney and pay Jim? I mean, is that why her total was more than Shannon's? $300,000 in attorney's fees to fight a slander suit is, that's high. But I guess where they live, you know, I'd like to know the hourly rate that that attorney was charging them.

We Wine Whenever (30:58.524)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (31:02.149)
Yeah, I know. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (31:13.949)
That is high.

We Wine Whenever (31:19.173)
Yeah, I don't know.

So then I loved when Shannon said that she won against Jim Bolino and that she took Alexis's job 10 years ago and she's still there.

Kelli (31:29.081)
Mm-hmm.

Kelli (31:33.848)
Yes, that was very good. Very, very good.

We Wine Whenever (31:35.749)
And then Alexis, yeah.

So then Alexis is trying to explain how Shannon is still lying, even though she showed the proof of the text message, because that wasn't a legal document. And she was saying that there was no legal documents with her name on it. Like, are you...

Kelli (31:55.896)
It doesn't like, it's, it's, it's logistics. it's, it's semantics. That's it. Not logistics. Yes.

We Wine Whenever (32:00.879)
It's, yeah, it's semantics. doesn't, it doesn't, yeah, yeah, it's semantics. Like give me a break. Are you really think that we're gonna buy that? You were that like, come on. And then even, right.

Kelli (32:10.146)
Yeah, you said we are going to sue you. That's the first line of communication to Shannon about this lawsuit. That was her point. You said we, so you were in on the legality.

We Wine Whenever (32:19.931)
Right. Right.

We Wine Whenever (32:25.349)
Right. And then even Emily jumped in and said, but you're named in the complaint. And she said, well, cause I'm the ex-wife, of course you should know that. Okay, no. You being the ex-wife has nothing to do with it. And you should know that like, come on.

Kelli (32:34.028)
No. Exactly. Right. If you were his wife, okay, but you're his ex-wife.

We Wine Whenever (32:45.595)
Yeah, I don't know that whole thing and even how she's trying to explain away the video. John didn't want me to say anything about the video. His attorney didn't even know about a video. Your attorney brought it up. So he couldn't be extorting you because I'm sure his attorney said WTF, like what is going on? This is extortion. You can't do that.

Kelli (32:55.854)
Yeah, right.

Kelli (33:08.949)
She said it on national television. That's, that's the extortion claim. Right. It was more against you than John.

We Wine Whenever (33:11.206)
I know.

Many times, many times, many times. Right.

Kelli (33:20.879)
I mean, talk about dumb. She is dumb.

We Wine Whenever (33:23.142)
Yep. Yeah.

Yeah, I will be happy when this thing is settled. For Shannon's sake, you know? Then Alexis says to Shannon, well, I've been on TV for 15 years, five different shows. And I love that when Shannon's like, so you're a TV star.

Kelli (33:34.072)
Yeah, for sure.

Kelli (33:47.29)
Yeah, like what why didn't anybody ask her to name them maybe they do next week what shows have you been on I Mean your her below deck episode. my goodness That was so cringy That I mean is she considering that show one of them

We Wine Whenever (33:53.786)
Yeah, because that's the end. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (33:59.93)
That was horrible.

We Wine Whenever (34:04.304)
It was bad.

We Wine Whenever (34:09.766)
Who knows?

Kelli (34:10.542)
Yeah, somebody's gotta say, name him, name him.

We Wine Whenever (34:12.797)
We need Sutton there. I'll tell you what though, that was a mic drop moment when she said that, when Shannon said that. You're a TV star.

Kelli (34:20.174)
Yes. Did you hear Tamara say that everybody had sympathy for Shannon having to film with Alexis? We all had sympathy for you. No, you didn't. You had no sympathy for her. You went at her every chance you could. I couldn't believe she said that. Tamara lives in a...

We Wine Whenever (34:32.888)
No. No.

We Wine Whenever (34:39.142)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (34:42.843)
I

Kelli (34:44.524)
in an alternate universe where she thinks, she thinks she's one of those housewives that thinks that we're stupid and the fans are stupid and we don't pay attention or, you know.

We Wine Whenever (34:55.194)
I agree. She is one of those housewives. And I just, feel like her and Teddy, those two right now are on the sinking ship. I mean, that is not going good. All the stories out there. Every day I see another story.

Kelli (35:02.756)
Yeah.

Kelli (35:10.668)
I don't think that podcast is gonna be around for long at all. Which is such a shame because it was good. It really was good. I mean, Tamra definitely effed it up with how she acted on the season and now this thing with Tati, mean.

Kelli (35:30.83)
the pregnant wife giving birth while you're together is not, that's not good. It's not good. And it carried, they carried on for months, right?

We Wine Whenever (35:35.868)
No, it's not good.

We Wine Whenever (35:41.029)
They did, and then I just recently read that he had done this with somebody else with her first child and they were going to, yes, and they were going to separate and then she got pregnant again.

Kelli (35:47.17)
We Wine Whenever (35:57.061)
So.

Kelli (35:57.156)
So this guy's just a dirty dog.

We Wine Whenever (35:59.696)
Yeah.

Kelli (36:02.604)
I mean, listen, I'm gonna say this. Teddy has said in the past that Edwin's been unfaithful and there are allegations now that he was being unfaithful again. So I understand Teddy stepping out of her marriage and being like, F you, I'm gonna do it too. But you don't do that with a married man.

certainly not a married man with a baby on the way, go find some single guy and do what you're gonna do. Like I get it, your husband's disrespecting you, you wanna give it right back to him, you know, I get it, but not with a married man because now you're hurting not only his wife, his children, yeah, you're affecting a whole other family. Go find some single guy. I'm sure there's plenty where you live.

We Wine Whenever (36:35.706)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (36:47.397)
Another family. Right.

We Wine Whenever (36:55.461)
Yeah.

I

Kelli (36:58.402)
So it's just not a good look. I think that that podcast is done.

We Wine Whenever (37:03.364)
We'll have to see because you know what? So many other Bravo people we thought were down and out and they're still here. Yeah, I was watching House of Villains today. I just couldn't. I got to episode three. It's interesting. It's interesting.

Kelli (37:08.677)
Teresa still around.

Kelli (37:13.59)
how was it?

Kelli (37:19.746)
Yeah. Somebody commented on one of our posts and said, Teresa haters. So I commented and said, well, one of us is, and it's me. He is a strong word, but I strongly dislike her, but it's

We Wine Whenever (37:27.288)
Yeah. It's funny because when I was watching it, Matt's like, do you hate Teresa? I said, no, I really don't hate anybody. just don't. just don't. said, you know, Kelly's not a big fan of hers, but yeah, I'm kind of indifferent about her. You know, I think that she's, you know, I don't agree with things that she does, but again, it's an entertaining show. I watch it for the entertainment. don't, you know.

Kelli (37:42.393)
Yeah.

Mm-mm.

Kelli (37:55.086)
Yeah, yeah. I do. I actually act like Melissa Gorgas like my sister and I have to defend her. It's crazy.

We Wine Whenever (37:56.676)
I don't take it to heart. I know you do. I know you do. I know you do. It is crazy. know.

Kelli (38:07.522)
And I don't know why. I really don't know why. I was listening to David Yontiff today. He had that woman on that he does his podcast with, and they were just kind of talking about the Teddy thing and all that stuff. But as I'm listening to him, I'm thinking in my head, he just says things that we all know. And he acts like he has some inside scoop. He's like, Candice is not coming back to Potomac. Okay, well we knew that.

We Wine Whenever (38:22.98)
Okay.

We Wine Whenever (38:35.981)
That's old news.

Kelli (38:37.048)
Candy is not coming back to Atlanta. Okay, why would she? like Kenya is not coming back. No, they basically fired her. Like he says these things as if like the housewives are actually calling him and telling him these things, but we know everything. I still like him. I'll still listen to him. I just thought it was still funny. Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (38:39.681)
Okay, more old news. Right.

We Wine Whenever (38:44.921)
She was fired. Right.

We Wine Whenever (38:52.141)
Right.

We Wine Whenever (38:56.845)
Yeah, no, I like him too. I like him too. I did read today some tea on Aaron Leach's husband Abe. I mean, it's probably public knowledge. I read it on, I think it was The Heavy, but he is not an attorney. He left his law firm to start a handbag business.

Kelli (39:22.745)
she mentioned that.

We Wine Whenever (39:24.418)
She did win.

Kelli (39:25.774)
He mentioned the handbag thing, or did Lori? I remember something about handbags, but they lost money on it.

We Wine Whenever (39:29.864)
maybe Lori did.

Kelli (39:36.824)
And that's why he took some of the money from the Bitcoin to pay off debt from that, right?

We Wine Whenever (39:41.169)
yes, yes, yes. So is that what he's doing now? Is he still doing the handbags?

Kelli (39:46.266)
I don't know. I thought he was an attorney. I thought he was still an attorney. I think I looked up his firm when the season first started. I was like, let me see where he works. Not that I know any firms in New York.

We Wine Whenever (39:56.195)
All right, she did say it was a business. but all right, now we're gonna have to find that out. Cause I don't know if he is an attorney still or he left it for a while and then went back. I don't know.

Kelli (40:01.856)
Yeah, we'll do some research.

Kelli (40:09.058)
Maybe. Yeah, maybe.

We Wine Whenever (40:10.744)
I don't, yeah, we'll have to see. And then what else did I heard? I was listening to Jax on, I think it's Hot Mike. It's the one that Alex Baskin does. I was listening to his side of the Jax and Brittany breakup and I listened to Brittany because he interviewed both of them separately. Yeah, so basically Jax tells a totally different story than Brittany, which is really no surprise.

Kelli (40:22.97)
Okay.

Kelli (40:30.946)
That's interesting.

Kelli (40:40.132)
shocker.

We Wine Whenever (40:40.972)
Brittany does not believe that he has changed, that he was rage texting her while he was in there. His explanation for that is because he interviewed Brittany first and then he asked Jacks the questions and he said, well, that was because she said that she was gonna bring Cruz to come see him and he had nobody and then she refused to. So that's why he was rage texting.

Kelli (41:02.148)
Why did he even have his phone? I've never heard of these facilities giving these people their cell phones.

We Wine Whenever (41:07.958)
Well, he's had his phone the whole time, he said. And that's the other thing that's, think we need to find this out, is that nobody's really clear if he was in a mental health facility or if he was in rehab, but it is pretty clear that Bravo gave him an ultimatum because there was a violent episode. And either you go, yes, that we're going to see involving Brittany.

Kelli (41:26.467)
on the valley?

damn.

We Wine Whenever (41:33.623)
Yeah, either you go and get help or you're fired.

Kelli (41:41.134)
I would imagine it's mental health facility and maybe that explains why he had his phone because I don't, I never heard of a rehab letting you have any device. Like you're there to get help. You're there to get clean. You can write letters. That's what you could do. And one phone call a day or you know, whatever that rule is. But I mean, I know out in California things are more catered to the patients, the clients, but that's interesting.

We Wine Whenever (41:52.875)
Yeah, right.

We Wine Whenever (42:02.379)
Different,

We Wine Whenever (42:09.865)
Yeah. I don't want to see that either, I would... Listen, she's on the other side of it now and she's strong. And listening to Britney, she's not going back. She's not. She's strong and she's, you know, she's in a good place.

Kelli (42:10.864)
I don't want to see that, but I guess we're gonna have to watch it.

Kelli (42:17.932)
Yes. Right.

Kelli (42:25.072)
yeah, I could never see her going back with him. She's, you know, when you're in something like that, I imagine, you don't see, you know, just with anything, when you're in a dysfunctional situation, you don't really see it for exactly what it is, but then when you're out of it, you're like, holy shit. And I'm sure she had that holy shit moment and she'll never go back.

We Wine Whenever (42:46.743)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (42:51.8)
She even said that she went and filed for divorce while he was still in the facility. And she did it because she was afraid that she would be weak and not be able to do it once he came out because she knows who he is and will come out and love bomb her and try and turn her. And she was afraid that she might, but once she made the decision, she's like, this is it. I'm doing this for my son and she's pissed.

Kelli (43:09.337)
Yeah.

Kelli (43:13.721)
Right.

Kelli (43:20.826)
Good for her.

We Wine Whenever (43:21.727)
She's pissed at him because he wound up, he wound up buying the place that, or either buying or renting the place that he's in next door to Schwartz while he was still in the facility. And she, which allowed her to go back to the home, but she had already paid three months rent on the other place that she was in. So now she's playing for two places. Like just again, him making decisions. Like she's been paying for everything this whole time.

Kelli (43:48.248)
Wow.

We Wine Whenever (43:49.899)
Yeah. So I thought that was interesting. The other thing I saw today, and I don't know if it's true, but I'm starting to think it is true. were trying to find out what happened to Jessica from Give Them La La. So Up and Adam led us to believe that she quit. And then somebody else said, it wasn't him, I saw somebody else said that it was over the election.

Kelli (43:54.072)
Very interesting.

Kelli (44:05.081)
Yeah.

Kelli (44:19.181)
What?

We Wine Whenever (44:20.201)
Yep, over the election.

Kelli (44:23.711)
come on. And they were friends, right?

We Wine Whenever (44:26.027)
Yeah. They were, they were friends. Yeah. I don't know if that's true, but that's kind of, listen, we knew that they didn't really leave on good terms. We, we know that she.

Kelli (44:34.862)
That would be such a shame if that was the reason why. Just let people think what they want to think and let's just get over it. How do you end a friendship over that? That's really sad.

We Wine Whenever (44:38.752)
Mm-hmm.

We Wine Whenever (44:45.459)
Yeah.

We Wine Whenever (44:51.392)
Yeah.

Kelli (44:54.574)
Ay, ay, ay.

We Wine Whenever (44:56.17)
I don't know if it's true, and probably we won't know for a while until she's able to talk.

Kelli (44:59.626)
Right. Right.

We Wine Whenever (45:03.05)
but I do think that that's sad. Either way, I think it's sad because like you said, they were, you know, she was on the podcast for three years. She was her personal assistant. They vacationed together. You know, she's told us many times she's taken pictures of Lala's hoo-ha and you know, other weird areas for her. And like they were close. They were really close.

Kelli (45:06.402)
I agree.

Kelli (45:21.881)
Right.

Yeah.

Wow, that's, I mean, just like you said, no matter what it was, it's upsetting that the breakup happened, but man, I really hope it wasn't over politics. Like people, come on.

We Wine Whenever (45:39.572)
I know. It just blows my mind when people can't look at people for who they are instead of like their politics. Like politics are politics. You've got to put them aside. Like you're not going to change.

Kelli (45:49.858)
And quite honestly, and we've talked about this, it's nobody's business where you stand politically. I went to vote with my daughter because it was her first time voting. I did not ask her who she voted for. It's not my business. It's not my business.

We Wine Whenever (46:06.196)
Right. Right.

Kelli (46:09.634)
We never talk about it on the podcast. It's nobody's business.

We Wine Whenever (46:13.597)
Right. I know. It's craziness to me.

Kelli (46:17.964)
Me too. I don't like it at all. I hope that's not the reason, but it, but you know what? It probably is. Me neither. Me neither. It's a strange, strange world we're in right now.

We Wine Whenever (46:24.923)
Nothing surprises me anymore to be quite honest with you. Nothing surprises me.

All right, I don't have anything else. Do you have anything else? Okay, until next time, check out our social media. We have a contest going on. Check it out. Bye. We do have a new website. It's going live probably tomorrow. It's www.wewinewhenever.com. we're gonna start, yep, we're gonna start putting all of our pods.

Kelli (46:35.744)
Nope, nope, that's it.

Kelli (46:44.248)
And don't we have a new website?

Kelli (46:51.405)
Okay.

Kelli (46:56.868)
Check it out.

We Wine Whenever (47:00.093)
Episodes will be on there, but we're start doing like a newsletter and more information, things like that. And merch, merch is coming. Okay, bye.

Kelli (47:07.276)
Yeah, baby. All right. Bye.