RHOC-Polygraph Pandemonium

Wendy (00:01.683)
Welcome to We Why I'm an Ever. I'm Wendy. We are talking about Real Housewives of Orange County, Season 19, Episode Number 8, Truth Tellers and Lie Detectors.

Kelli (00:04.119)
I'm Kelly.

Kelli (00:16.558)
Oh, I thought this was, I have episode nine down. Is it eight? I don't know why I put nine. Maybe I went to type eight and it hit nine.

Wendy (00:26.939)
I'm not 100 % sure it's eight, but I think it is. Let me just... Yeah, yeah, it's about the lie detectors. mean, we start out... This is my thought. First of all, if it is episode eight, which is I think what it is, I cannot believe that...

Kelli (00:31.926)
Either way, it's about the lie detector, so we know that.

Wendy (00:52.207)
I cannot believe that it's only episode eight because I feel like we've been watching this forever.

Kelli (00:57.344)
I totally agree. Not only do I feel like we've been watching it forever, but I'm bored. I'm bored with the Katie Witch Hunt. And I think that that is just what this is. And I'm bored with the fact that Emily is, you know, Heather and Tamara's employee and doing their dirty work. But we'll get there. We'll get there.

Wendy (00:58.387)
Right? mean...

Wendy (01:14.855)
Yeah, we will get there. So we start out with Heather and Terry in their LA apartment, their penthouse. and her two sons are talking and Slade and Gretchen and Skylar are talking. And then we see Shannon and Jean the machine. They're out at the restaurant and they are celebrating his 96th birthday. Shannon's telling her dad that, you know,

Kelli (01:33.481)
Mm-hmm.

Wendy (01:42.983)
Tamara apologized to her, but she's not really gonna be jumping back into it. Although she appreciates the apology, there's a lot of hurt that she has with Tamara because she really came for her last season and she came for her heart. Yeah, yeah.

Kelli (01:56.872)
yeah, real hard. And what I do love is that Shannon's not holding back. Like she, she says things as she's noticing them this season. Like when, you know, Gretchen and Tamra were, you know, going back and forth and they asked Gretchen, did you apologize? And Shannon was like, that's one thing, verse 12,000 that Tamra did to her. And it's true.

Wendy (02:08.273)
Yes.

Wendy (02:24.177)
Yeah, it's absolutely true. Yeah, agree.

Kelli (02:27.48)
So I'm glad that Shannon's opening her mouth. Because Gina, well Gina kind of is too actually. But Emily's not going to. Heather's not going to.

Wendy (02:36.467)
No, we're seeing a different Emily this season, feel like. Well, it's actually last season and this season.

Kelli (02:41.14)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yep.

Wendy (02:46.579)
Shannon, I guess, hired a Marilyn Monroe impersonator to sing Happy Birthday to her dad, which was cute. Gretchen meets up with Gina. They go out to lunch because they are going to be meeting with Kiki Monique and Gretchen didn't want to be there by herself. She wanted a witness. So Gina agreed to go with her.

Kelli (02:56.717)
Yeah.

Wendy (03:13.787)
So Kiki gets there and she says that Katie told her that Gretchen went to the hospital after the naked wasted dinner and she was drugged.

Kelli (03:22.572)
Mm-hmm.

Wendy (03:23.857)
Gretchen seems very surprised. Keke also says that Gina was also a topic of conversation. since she said she was trying to, when Katie came on, she said she really wanted to highlight Asian designers and she wanted to showcase them and give them a platform. So at one point she had on an outfit and Gina had made a comment to her about

Kelli (03:43.342)
Mm-hmm.

Wendy (03:53.804)
that doesn't look very Asian, an Asian inspired designer. And I don't know if it was.

Kelli (03:59.81)
Which is kind of a stupid comment to me.

Wendy (04:02.673)
It is very stupid comment to make. It is.

Kelli (04:04.898)
Like what is it supposed to look like? Just because the person's Asian, they can design clothes however the hell they want.

Wendy (04:12.735)
I mean, I think it was when she was, you know, like wearing, I think she was wearing specific designers like Balmain and other like YSL and stuff that she obviously knew were not Asian designers. But the way Kiki took it was like, well, that's kind of like a racist thing to say, which I can understand. But now again, I do vaguely remember her saying that when she first started Katie.

that she wanted to highlight Asian designers. So people are questioning Kiki about this whole thing. Why would she have to do this sit down? And I saw her online and she spoke about this specifically. And one of the things she said is she had no intentions of bringing up the Gina thing, but.

The reason she did is she really wanted them to know that this is really something that happened. Like this was a real conversation. cause when they, when they do it on the show, they flash back to the scene where they're on their bicycles and she makes that comment. That scene was never seen before. So we wouldn't, it was, I mean, they even put on their never before seen. So we as the viewer wouldn't have known about that. So Kiki couldn't make that up.

Kelli (05:24.536)
I don't remember it now.

Kelli (05:28.92)
Yeah.

Wendy (05:34.769)
And I honestly, listen, I don't think Kiki was making anything up, but this is proof that there's no way Kiki could have made it up, because how would she even have known about it? Because it's nothing we saw, right? It was nothing we saw before.

Kelli (05:35.244)
Right, right.

Kelli (05:45.494)
Right. Right.

Kelli (05:50.338)
Yeah. I just don't understand why Katie is still saying she didn't tell Kiki. Like she's still denying it, right? She's still denying that she told Kiki this story. I'm pretty sure she still denied it. In this episode, I don't know about right now.

Wendy (06:00.805)
I don't know that she's still denying it be quite honest with you.

You think so? in this... perhaps in this episode she's still denying it. Yeah.

Kelli (06:13.538)
Yeah, like at this point the jig is up, but you're still not the bad guy. The bad guy is Gretchen for saying it to begin with and now lying about it. And Tamara's the ultimate bad guy for doing this in general, trying to get her naked wasted.

Wendy (06:30.849)
Yes, exactly.

Kelli (06:32.949)
I mean, Katie telling Kiki to me is like a minor thing. So why do you keep denying it at this point?

Wendy (06:41.043)
It is a minor thing, but this is my guess as to why she's still denying it. She's still alone. She's got nobody there with her. And everyone is coming for her. She's got nobody by her side. was her friend. And Jen is not backing her. Jen is not backing her. So I think if Jen had backed her and said, listen, you know what Gretchen did tell us this information?

Kelli (06:54.572)
Yeah.

Kelli (07:00.766)
No she's not. No she's not.

Wendy (07:09.629)
then she might've said, well, okay, I did tell Kiki. But she has nobody at this point. I'm not saying what she's doing is right. I mean, she's definitely lied. She's definitely lied about the Kiki thing. She's on the after show though. Did you watch it?

Kelli (07:19.554)
Right.

Kelli (07:28.192)
I know, but it popped up on my peacock and I was like, I have to watch that, but I didn't have time.

Wendy (07:33.639)
So Katie's on the after show and the after show was filmed after this started filming. Cause I remember Shannon telling me, telling us when she was on Watch What Happens Live, she told me, yeah, Shannon told me that she was, yeah, that she was doing hers with Heather and that's who in fact she's doing it with. So I know that these are, know, fairly recent.

Kelli (07:39.629)
Mm-hmm.

Kelli (07:44.685)
as she called you.

You're like this.

Kelli (07:56.591)
So Shannon's with Heather. Who's Tamara with? Emily and Gina.

Wendy (07:58.555)
Shannon's with Heather and Tamar is with Emily and Gina and Jen and Gretchen are together.

Kelli (08:08.29)
and Katie's not on it.

Wendy (08:09.789)
Katie's on it by herself. Katie is on it. So the fact that Katie is on it, the fact that they put at the end of the episode, producers decided that, you know, she was not gonna be on for, you know, giving her a break. I think she'll definitely be at the reunion. I think she'll be at the reunion. Yeah, because it's not like she quit. It's not like she was fired, right?

Kelli (08:12.405)
so

Kelli (08:26.446)
Mm-hmm.

Kelli (08:29.819)
I hope so.

Kelli (08:36.514)
I hope so.

Wendy (08:37.509)
She's still doing, she's doing the after show. I mean, I think we're gonna, you know, and she's doing, I mean, she's doing all the rounds. She's been on many podcasts. She's talking to other people, right?

Kelli (08:49.538)
I don't know why she did this with Kiki. don't know why she wanted to. Well, I still stand firm that I don't think she thought she was coming back. And that's why she did this. But it was a bad move, man.

Wendy (09:02.683)
Yeah, I mean, it was a bad move. The other theory about it is, you know, she was out to lunch with who she thought was a girlfriend. Maybe she had a few drinks and just started talking and didn't think it would be repeated. You know, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Gina, after they find out...

Kelli (09:12.782)
Come on.

Kelli (09:19.114)
I don't know. That's pretty salacious. Yeah.

Wendy (09:28.401)
you know, what Kiki says, Gina asked Gretchen if she feels better and Gretchen's crying and says, you know, people were trying to tell me, you know, I do feel like, listen, I totally felt like her crying was totally fake. Those tears were fake.

Kelli (09:40.43)
100 %

Wendy (09:42.705)
Right? mean, that wasn't real.

Kelli (09:44.551)
Absolutely.

Wendy (09:46.835)
The fact that her and Slade went on Heather McDonald and they did their whole big spiel explaining the whole how she misspoke and how, you know, because we see her on...

Kelli (09:58.313)
when she said I misspoke, I'm like, okay, I just really lost it for you. And when Slade said that he couldn't do the bachelor because he was still under contract by Bravo and NBC, I'm like, I don't even know if I can listen to the rest of this. I did, but I thought it was all nonsense. I thought, I thought they came off terribly in that interview. You misspoke?

Wendy (10:05.363)
Right.

Wendy (10:23.004)
I did too.

Kelli (10:24.802)
That was probably the most honest we've ever seen Gretchen at all her whole time on reality TV was when she said that in the back of the car. Because like I said last week, she like, her voice got real low and just the way she looked at Tamra, she was like, but I, but I did, I did go to the hospital. I was so sick. That was probably the most honest we've ever seen Gretchen. I don't know what she thought. Like, did she think that the producers weren't going to show that?

I really, I really believe that when she said that she was being honest. So I'm sorry you did not misspeak.

Wendy (11:04.037)
Yeah. And another interesting thing is, it just came out, I don't know if it was us weekly, but there was one publication that spoke to Katie and the only housewife she's currently speaking with. Take a guess. Nope. Yes.

Kelli (11:20.088)
Gretchen? The only one she's speaking with? Jen?

Kelli (11:28.76)
Heather?

Wendy (11:29.853)
camera.

Kelli (11:31.554)
Wait a minute, the only housewife Gretchen is speaking with right now is Tamara.

Wendy (11:35.645)
Katie, Katie, the only housewife that is speaking with Katie right now is Tamara and Katie really appreciates it. I'm like, Katie.

Kelli (11:40.544)
I believe that. For sure.

Kelli (11:48.194)
That's crazy. I'm sorry, I thought you were talking about Gretchen.

Wendy (11:51.897)
No, Katie. I'm like Katie, poor girl. Like she appreciates it because she thinks that like Tamar's being genuine. Tamar's speaking with you right now because Tamar sees everything that's being said online. everyone is saying that Katie was set up. Everyone says the lie detector test was bullshit. Everyone thinks that Katie was set up. Everyone, yeah, everyone.

Kelli (12:08.191)
Absolutely.

Kelli (12:15.086)
She was. Lie detector test was totally bullshit. Totally bullshit. Totally rigged.

Wendy (12:20.443)
Every single person is, not every single person, a majority of the viewers are Team Katie on this whole situation. They all agree that she should not have lied about talking to Kiki. So of course, Tamar's gonna talk to Katie.

Kelli (12:26.478)
Mm-hmm.

Kelli (12:32.782)
Katie should go back and watch the last season that Gretchen was on or maybe the second to last season Gretchen was on the second day when Tamra befriended her under false pretense. She was a slithering snake Tamra. She got right in there. She pretended to be Gretchen's friend to get her trust and then she stabbed her right in the back to get her off the show. She they wanted her off the show her and Vicky. That's what Tamra did. That's that's who's befriending you.

that person, that slithering snake.

Wendy (13:03.251)
Yep.

Kelli (13:10.616)
That's crazy.

Wendy (13:14.607)
Okay, so the next thing we see is Heather and Terry and three of her kids are playing poker in her LA apartment. Turns out she rents an apartment downstairs in the same building that she has her penthouse and that's where the family hangs out and the penthouse is only for sexy time. What?

Kelli (13:34.668)
I don't need that visual, Heather.

Wendy (13:36.836)
No, we don't need that.

Kelli (13:38.636)
And I don't want to hear about your real estate anymore.

Wendy (13:42.675)
Okay, well they're talking about the Beverly Hills House being for sale for 25 million. Heather says that they said it would take 90 days to sell. They purchased it in 2023 for 16 million dollars, but it ultimately sold for 16.5 million in August of 2025. So,

Kelli (14:02.168)
So they definitely lost money because they held on to it for so long so they had to pay taxes. Can't even imagine what the taxes are, right? And they only profited, right.

Wendy (14:08.219)
Right. And plus they put money into it. They didn't profit anything. They put money into it.

Kelli (14:12.654)
I'm saying they sold it for 500,000 more than they bought it for, but all the expenses they incurred while they were under ownership, I'm sure it's way exceeded 500 grand. Yeah.

Wendy (14:20.775)
Right.

for sure. Yeah, and then plus commissions that they had to pay. Heather asks the three where that they would like the family home to be and Nick says Palm Springs and Kat says LA and Ace doesn't answer. I feel like Ace was gonna answer, but they didn't let Ace answer. So we don't know where Ace wants to live or Ace.

Kelli (14:45.102)
Pom Springs sounds lovely though, I'm with Nick.

Wendy (14:50.595)
Yeah, I think so too. mean, I wouldn't want

Kelli (14:53.144)
I mean, I've seen Palm Spring Houses on Real Housewives of Beverly Hills. I'm with Nick on that one.

Wendy (14:57.895)
Yeah.

Wendy (15:01.873)
Yeah. So then the next thing we see is Emily is throwing the Persian New Year party. What? Naroos it's called, Naroos. We find out that Shane's mom is Persian and usually celebrates this holiday, but because his stepdad is in the hospital, she's not celebrating it this year. So Emily decides that she's going to celebrate this new year.

Kelli (15:10.498)
Now, ruse.

Kelli (15:28.984)
I like the tradition, which he said, of jumping over the fire to take away your weakness and give you strength. It sounds dangerous, but it also sounds very productive.

Wendy (15:39.909)
So my thought about this whole thing is, know, I'm not Persian. Emily's not Persian. I just think that she should have not done this because I don't really think that she represented the party or the celebration the way it should have been represented. I feel as though if that was my culture and I have someone who's not even of that same culture.

It just didn't make sense to me. mean...

Kelli (16:10.808)
Well, obviously she needed an excuse to get them in her house so she could do the lie detector test and pay those people to say what they said. I mean, obviously, it was just a ruse.

Wendy (16:21.157)
It was definitely a ruse. I just think it's unfortunate that she used no ruse for the ruse. We sure did. Katie's getting ready to go and she's saying that she's nervous because she hasn't seen any of them since New Orleans, which I don't blame her. Emily lets us know that she has.

Kelli (16:29.344)
Neruse was a ruse. We really set that one up well. I don't even have that in my notes.

Kelli (16:48.973)
Yeah.

Wendy (16:49.829)
two lie detector people there. First of all, that

Kelli (16:52.93)
Yeah, Katie said she's hoping that they can move forward and start a new beginning. I think she's overshooting.

Wendy (17:00.633)
Yeah, she sure is. That one guy that was there is the guy that has been on many shows before.

Kelli (17:02.112)
Yeah.

Kelli (17:07.754)
Okay, I didn't recognize him, but you said that.

Wendy (17:10.259)
I also saw that one of the questions he asked Gretchen if she's ever had a lie detector test before and she says no and she passed that but then they show you in 2014 the very same guy gave her a lie detector test on TV.

Kelli (17:23.406)
wait, was that the marriage bootcamp thing she insulated? I saw that clip or meme, whatever the hell it is. Hysterical. That's hysterical.

Wendy (17:26.821)
Yes. Yes. Yes. this? Yes. Same guy.

Wendy (17:38.309)
So it just shows you the validity of this test, right? Such.

Kelli (17:42.572)
Yes, exactly. And the validity of the guy administering the test.

Wendy (17:47.109)
Exactly, exactly. Then Emily and Gina, they go up front and they egg the front of the house to ward off evil. Everyone that walks in, someone egged your house, someone egged your house. I mean, we come to find out that Emily says on the after show that, you know, she doesn't exactly know what it's for, it's supposed to like ward off evil. But when she would go to her mother-in-law's house for it, her mother-in-law would egg it.

Kelli (17:57.038)
You

Yeah, yeah.

Wendy (18:15.843)
after everybody left. exactly. It makes no sense. Like it just made no sense.

Kelli (18:20.142)
So why did you do it before?

Kelli (18:24.438)
It doesn't make any sense. So it would be on camera, I guess.

Wendy (18:27.719)
I mean, I don't know. It just made no sense. Yeah, for Neruse. So Heather shows up. She's got a thing on her nose. I guess she had a nose biopsy. And she asked if Tamara had been invited. And they said yes. know, Emily said I sent her the same text that I sent everybody.

Kelli (18:30.656)
Well, none of it did. The whole thing. The whole ruse.

Wendy (18:51.675)
Heather's telling them that Tamra's pissed and Emily's afraid that she's gonna come in hot, which is generally how she comes in. I mean, Tamra does usually come in hot. I don't know if you noticed this too, when she did come in, Tamra, Gina went up to her right away and Tamra apologized to Gina. And I don't know if you heard Shannon say, well, did you hear that? Yeah, she acknowledged it like right, okay, that's it. And, right.

Kelli (18:57.912)
For sure. Yep.

Kelli (19:14.274)
Yes. Yes, I did.

And now we're gonna pretend like nothing ever happened.

Wendy (19:21.209)
Exactly. Exactly. Yeah.

Kelli (19:22.35)
she gets a pass.

And this is after Gina was saying that she thinks it's ridiculous that Tamra's playing victim.

Wendy (19:31.185)
Yep. Yep.

Kelli (19:33.184)
Okay, so I think Tamra walks in at this point, okay? And I'm watching, and then Tamra does show up, and I'm like, wait a minute, what? I rewound, I actually thought Jen was Tamra when she walked in.

Wendy (19:37.97)
Mm-hmm.

Wendy (19:50.008)
really? my god, that's so funny.

Kelli (19:53.16)
I know! I really thought it was Tamra and it Jen.

Wendy (19:57.351)
That's funny. So Emily asks them all to write down questions that they want to ask all the ladies and they're going to be anonymous. Which, okay, that's how you're coming up with your questions. Katie's sitting there on the couch. She's not talking to anyone. Very uncomfortable.

Kelli (19:59.503)
Yeah.

Wendy (20:20.057)
It was hard to tell by the editing, but I think after listening to Katie on the after show, she did say she wasn't feeling well and she went in the bathroom and she said she threw up. That was actually, they made it seem like it was after the lie detector test, it was before the lie detector test. was before the, that's what I got from the after show. was before the lie detector test.

Kelli (20:36.269)
Yes they did.

Wendy (20:45.563)
And she also said that when she had left the house, she's like, I forgot my anxiety medicine. Should I go back and get it? And she decided not to. I mean, she certainly should have gotten it because being with this group of women, you know, I don't know.

Kelli (20:58.242)
Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, she had a very...

strong reaction to having to sit for a lie detector test. She did. She had a very strong reaction.

Wendy (21:14.077)
Well, so did Shannon though. mean, Shannon even said, I'm not doing that. I don't know if you remember when it was announced, Shannon's like, I'm not doing that. I don't blame her. And yeah, no, Shannon said that. And even if you look at them, Heather had her jacket on. Like they had the thing over her jacket. Come on. You know what I mean? how, this is all bullshit.

Kelli (21:23.224)
I didn't even notice that.

Kelli (21:34.902)
Right. Right.

Kelli (21:39.784)
It was it was all bullshit. It was all rigged for sure for sure

Wendy (21:46.703)
Honestly, I don't even know if I blame Emily for this. I think I blame production. I think this was production's idea. I think this entire thing was production's idea.

Kelli (21:55.336)
sure but Emily went along with it and and on Tamra's behalf let's face it

Wendy (21:57.905)
She did. She did.

Wendy (22:03.227)
I mean, yeah. Yeah.

So when Tamra gets...

Kelli (22:07.502)
Jen couldn't answer what half of 10 times five was.

Wendy (22:11.633)
It wasn't, no, it wasn't, yeah, it was half a 10 times five, yeah. 10 times five, right. I'm sure she was nervous.

Kelli (22:14.85)
Half of 10 times 5.

Kelli (22:20.354)
I mean, maybe she was nervous though. I I would have been nervous to sit there because you don't have anything to lie about, it's like, you know, it's, is it basing it off of? Like my heart's gonna beat fast anyway for something like that.

Wendy (22:35.707)
And now for nothing, I thought the lie detector test questions are supposed to be yes or no answers. So why are you asking her math questions? Like seriously, why are you?

Kelli (22:41.198)
That's right.

Kelli (22:44.726)
Right. Yeah, and I think they even said just answer yes or no.

Wendy (22:49.861)
Right. Why are you asking, you know, it's supposed to be yes or no questions and you're asking her math questions.

Kelli (22:55.436)
Right. Shannon said she has nightmares about this. It's a weird thing to have nightmares about.

Wendy (22:57.555)
just.

Poor Shannon.

Wendy (23:04.721)
Yeah, so Tamara gets there and Emily says, are you mad at me? She said, you didn't call me. And then Emily's like, yes, I did. Like, Tara in her mind really thinks that nobody called her.

Kelli (23:15.98)
Or she's just lying, because she's a liar.

Wendy (23:18.725)
Right. And that's when Katie gets up. That's when Katie gets up and says she feels sick. This is before we even know about the lie detector test.

Kelli (23:28.344)
I think somebody on production told her about it.

Wendy (23:31.291)
Katie, mean, anything's possible. After they find out about the lie detector test, Shannon's like, that's why there's no alcohol here. And Heather said, and Heather said, and aftershock, she's like, I just thought Emily was being cheap, not having alcohol.

Kelli (23:32.334)
Mm-hmm.

Kelli (23:55.033)
Like what a not nice thing to say about your friend. Right? Like...

Wendy (23:58.707)
It's strange.

Yeah. So the instructions that they get are yes or no, or the answers they're to give, and they're not to talk in between the questions. And some of the questions are, your name Emily? Is your name Jennifer? Obviously Heather got the one, would you rather be a housewife of Beverly Hills? And she said yes.

Kelli (24:24.142)
you

Kelli (24:28.716)
I'm telling you, I don't think they wanted her. I think she tried and I don't think they wanted her, whether it was the cast or production. Somebody didn't want her and that's why she's still on OC.

Wendy (24:43.123)
I'm sure that's it. I'm sure that's it. One of the questions was, are you currently keeping any secrets? We don't know what the answer to that was, because they never gave it to us. Even when, Heather, can you speak any Russian? They asked her that. I have no idea. Does Travis have big balls? They asked Gina.

Kelli (25:01.388)
Why would they ask her that? Is she Russian?

Kelli (25:08.962)
That was funny.

Wendy (25:12.847)
Emily, they asked her, you talk badly about Heather Dubrow in front of your children?

And she said, no. Do you think you're a better lawyer than Shane? And she said, yes.

Kelli (25:25.474)
hahahaha

Wendy (25:29.808)
Tamar, were you really told you were on the spectrum of autism? She said yes. She failed. I mean, we all know that that's not true. So like, why?

Kelli (25:35.918)
fail

Wendy (25:41.811)
Gina, did you say you keep Heather around for her real estate contact? She said no. Heather, did you call the paparazzi to meet you at Disneyland? She said no and they said she failed.

Kelli (25:47.374)
So stupid.

Kelli (25:55.704)
definitely call the paparazzi.

Wendy (25:58.525)
Tamar, do you make contact with Slade's ex to dig up information? She said yes. She said yes. Do you want a friend, do you want a friendship with Shannon? She said yes. They asked Shannon, did you make out with multiple men? She said yes.

Kelli (26:08.088)
Yeah, she knew she would have failed it.

Wendy (26:20.915)
They asked Shannon, do you want a friendship with Tamara? And she answered maybe. And that passed. Well, how can that pass? It's supposed to be yes or no. Like this is what I'm saying.

Kelli (26:30.466)
Yes or no?

Wendy (26:35.997)
So while Gretchen and Katie are getting the lie detector test, the other women are downstairs asking Gina if she met with Kiki yesterday. And what happened? And Gina said, it's really not her place to talk about it. She'll leave that for Gretchen. Which just means she wants everyone there. They asked Katie, did you play the recording of Shannon for Alexis? She said, no. They said she failed that. Did you leak any stories to the press?

She said no. Did Gretchen tell you that she was drugged and went to the hospital? She said yes. He said she failed.

Kelli (27:12.418)
and they said she failed that too.

Wendy (27:14.139)
Yeah. Did you tell Kiki that Gretchen said she was drugged and hospitalized? She said no, which we know she did.

Kelli (27:22.36)
Yeah, I don't understand why she's like denying.

Wendy (27:25.399)
Gretchen, did you plant stories about Tamar in the media? No. They said she passed that. Did you go to the hospital after naked wasted? She said no.

They didn't say whether or not she passed that. mean, give me a break. Did you tell Katie and Jen that you were drugged? She said no. We don't know if she passed that either. We don't know if she passed that. They didn't tell us. Did you

Kelli (27:42.126)
They did not. They did not say.

Kelli (27:57.955)
Right. Right. no, I have here, I have here Gretchen got a truthful test. Gretchen got a truthful test. Katie failed everything and Gretchen passed everything.

Wendy (28:07.389)
Well, that's what

Wendy (28:15.037)
Well, that's what the one, yes, that's what the tester said, but other things they would give us the exact questions and what the answers were.

Kelli (28:18.423)
Yeah.

Kelli (28:22.216)
Right, that's true, that's true. But he did say she got a truthful test. Isn't that coincidental that Gretchen did and Katie didn't?

Wendy (28:24.295)
So.

Yeah, I mean.

Wendy (28:32.477)
Right.

Wendy (28:36.051)
Jen, did you befriend Tamar with ulterior motives? She said no. Do you trust Katie Gianella? She said yes.

They asked her if she has any serious reservations about marrying Ryan. She said no.

Kelli (28:53.485)
Failed that.

Wendy (28:54.675)
Yes, she said you reacted significantly and she failed that one. What does that mean? It's a yes or no question. Katie said, I'm not lying. Gretchen said, I met with Kiki yesterday and this is after they're all done with their tests. And she said that you said all this stuff. Gretchen and Jen are both maintaining that Gretchen said she was sick as shit and should have gone to the hospital. So this is really where the problem lies is that

Kelli (29:01.774)
I don't believe that either though.

Wendy (29:24.221)
Gretchen did say this to Katie and Jen, and Jen is not backing her. And Katie's out there on her own, and she already told Kiki this, and she's the one who looks like the liar. I mean, she did lie about telling her, but Gretchen is the one who gave her the story to begin with, because how would she have known about it? How would she have known about it?

Kelli (29:45.356)
Right. Right.

Wendy (29:50.109)
Like why doesn't anybody ask that? Like why would she put that story out there? If she didn't get it from Gretchen, she wouldn't have known about it.

Kelli (30:01.153)
I know. That's why I don't understand why Katie is still at this point on the show denying that she did it. Like it's very obvious that you said it, that's not the problem. The problem is that Gretchen said it to you.

Wendy (30:03.324)
And then

Wendy (30:15.919)
Right. Right.

Kelli (30:17.794)
That's like, so just admit that you did it because we all know you did it. Just like you said, nobody else. Kiki saying it was you, I mean.

Wendy (30:25.723)
Right. Right. It was you.

Kelli (30:30.648)
But at the end, she's talking to a producer outside. My DVR cut off after this. So I watched this Thursday night after it played, and I had to watch it on my DVR because it wasn't on Peacock yet. And my DVR cut off right after Katie was outside talking to the producer, and she was like, this is bullshit, I didn't do it.

I didn't lie. That's what she said. This is bullshit. I didn't lie.

Wendy (30:59.793)
Yeah, she did say that I have that written down. Because then Emily starts yelling at Katie, nobody believes you not even a lie detector test you failed every single question. Which and then kicked her out, which I you know, first of all, it was so aggressive the way she did it. It was totally uncalled for. Gretchen in her confessional says I feel like an idiot because I believed her and I didn't I didn't believe the other women and now I feel like an idiot. Okay, well you are an idiot Gretchen and that's not the reason why.

Kelli (31:06.637)
and kicks her out.

Kelli (31:14.552)
Horrible horrible

Yes.

Kelli (31:29.187)
Right.

Wendy (31:29.901)
Gina says that you told Katie that I was insinuating that I was racist. Well, I mean, what you said was racist. It was.

Kelli (31:42.51)
It had, it definitely had an undertone to it. Like snarky, like, is that one of your Asian? It was.

Wendy (31:46.181)
Yes, it did.

Right, and I don't think she meant it that way, but that's how it was. That's how it was.

Kelli (31:53.977)
She probably thought she was being snarky, like, you know, but I mean, it's 2025. Like, haven't learned, know, we know to do better.

Wendy (31:57.469)
Right.

Wendy (32:07.547)
Right, we do. So Katie was outside the house talking to producer Kendall and said, I did not lie and that's what makes me so upset. Tamara asked if she admitted meeting with Kiki and Gretchen and Jen said, yes, she admitted to me meeting with Kiki, but she said she never brought us up when she spoke to Kiki. Producers told Katie she should take a break from filming and then we see it, you know, that she's not gonna be on.

And she's also put out there that she was glad that she didn't go on the Amsterdam trip because it would have been horrible for her. It would have been horrible.

Kelli (32:38.732)
Yeah. Yes. Yes. I mean, like you said, Emily was very aggressive asking her to leave her house. That was very aggressive.

Wendy (32:48.786)
Yeah.

Wendy (32:52.371)
She really was. mean, I was taken aback by it. was like, I mean, this is supposed to be a Persian New Year celebration. And this is how you're acting. This is how you betrayed it. And you throw someone out of your house. Like the whole thing, it was just so off-putting. This whole season, the way... Well.

Kelli (33:00.972)
Right.

Kelli (33:12.27)
the whole season, that's what I'm saying, I'm bored. It's not enjoyable to watch, producers. Like come up with a new formula because the constant cat fights and them going after each other, it's just not enjoyable. I mean, you can have a little drama here and there, but I don't know. I just don't wanna watch women fight with each other.

Wendy (33:19.312)
It's not.

Wendy (33:35.505)
No, I don't either. Not over nonsense. Not over, especially something that happened 17 years ago. Who cares? Who cares?

Kelli (33:38.188)
Right, right.

Right.

Kelli (33:46.755)
Yeah, but if you guys haven't heard and listened to the Heather McDonald interview with Gretchen Inslee, definitely listen to it and let us know what you think because I thought they sounded, I don't think they came off very well, personally. And now Tamra is gonna be on Jeff Lewis's podcast, so we'll have to listen to that.

Wendy (34:08.741)
Yeah, so he was, she was on, if any of our listeners have serious, you can listen to it. It happened already. And then we don't have serious, so we have to wait for it to come to her show. I'm hoping it drops on Monday. And then we'll get a little bit more insight as to what actually happened. But I'm just very disappointed with this whole season. I just think they can do better and they should do better. I mean, unfortunately it's over now, so we're just gonna have to.

Kelli (34:21.879)
Yeah.

Kelli (34:31.832)
Yeah, they should do better.

Wendy (34:38.419)
wait and see how it ends up and what happens at the reunion. But I hope Katie gets vindicated at the reunion and I hope that she comes back next season. I really do. I hope she comes back.

Kelli (34:47.671)
I do too.

Kelli (34:53.454)
I do too. hope that we, you know, I hope it's proven that Gretchen was lying. You know, obviously because of HIPAA, you can't, but I mean, there's hospital records. This was 17 years ago though. I don't know what the law is on that. Like I know attorneys have to hold on to records for seven years. I don't know about hospital records, but there has to be a record somewhere of her.

showing up at hospital.

Wendy (35:24.913)
Yeah.

Kelli (35:26.05)
But with HIPAA, guess if she doesn't, you know, if she doesn't request it.

Wendy (35:27.899)
now. She would be have to, right, she would have to be the one requesting it. And that's not going to happen because...

Kelli (35:36.948)
Even a doctor couldn't come out and say it. Right.

Wendy (35:39.833)
No, no, no. So we'll have to wait and see.

Kelli (35:45.772)
Yes, we will.

Wendy (35:47.507)
Okay, so until next time, thank you for watching and listening. Please give us five star reviews and subscribe. Bye.

Kelli (35:53.967)
Bye.